Fattah Leads in New Poll

A new poll commissioned by Pennsylvanians for Effective Government shows that Congressman Chaka Fattah would win the mayoral primary if it were held tomorrow. 29% of likely primary voters indicated they would support Fattah. Michael Nutter and Dwight Evans both received 12%. Congressman Bob Brady received 10%. Support for both Tom Knox and John Dougherty is stuck in single digits.

I’m not an expert on polling, but I think this survey is extremely interesting. Some might claim it is meaningless because the ward leaders control the vote. That’s simply not true in a high profile race that will receive tons of media coverage. People will make up their own mind about which candidate is best. Ward leaders typically have much less control in a mayoral election.

So, what does it all mean? Click “Read More” to find out.

First, I am impressed by Fattah’s strong showing. It appears that there is a consensus candidate for Mayor—and it’s not Bob Brady. Fattah has broad support all over the city and even outpolled Brady in his own congressional district. Almost all likely voters were somewhat familiar with Fattah and his favorable ratings were also extremely high.

Second, Jonathan Saidel’s exit from the mayor’s race seems to have done absolutely nothing for Congressman Bob Brady. White voters didn’t flock from one white guy to another. Michael Nutter is now the top choice for most white voters. Fattah comes in second. A sizeable majority of both black and white voters claim that race will not play a factor in their vote for mayor.

The results of this poll show that Philadelphia can actually avoid a divisive and bitter primary. If Fattah’s support holds, it will be extremely difficult for other candidates to seriously contend for the nomination. This could be good for the Democratic Party and good for the city.

(Disclosure: I'm leaning towards supporting either Chaka Fattah or Dwight Evans for mayor)

Uggh

"This could be good for the Democratic Party and good for the city."

(Disclosure: I'm telling everyone in sight voting for Fattah is a terrible idea and Nutter is the best candidate for the city)

How can anyone who lies about his personal educational record or sues to have Philly's campaign finance rules overturned be good for the City, especially one with as much corruption as Philly?

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Phillyville

All I can tell you is that

All I can tell you is that in a City where something like half the public school kids don't graduate from high school, I think the attacks on his education record are a 100 percent dead end.

I can see it now, Fattah the

I can see it now, Fattah the education mayor. The slogan: Why does school matter anyway? I'm a Congressman.

Maybe his failure to graduate makes him better to understand the situation and could be by his educational initiatives have been decent. But, even though I could imagine it being embarrassing, he is a public figure and shouldn't lie about his not graduating.

Com'on

Seriously, how much does this really matter? Fattah has done a ton to make sure that Philly kids get a good education.

I really think this whole thing is just a distraction. Let's focus on policy, not personalities. What is the actual impact of Fattah's educational background on his ability to fight for Philly's kids? None.

---
http://benwaxman.com

What is the actual impact of

What is the actual impact of Fattah's dishonesty? Maybe a further perpetuation that it is okay to lie, cheat and steal in politics.

How much does it really matter? Probably not too much. It could influence my vote. But, one has to distinguish on something. And, based on all of the great policy papers he has put out that are not on his website, what else can I go on. He has not campaigned anywhere I have been. He has not, as far as I know, touched ethnic-white South Philadelphia yet. So, really, what else do I have to go on??? And, if it is a distraction, it is because where the hell is he. I can't walk down the street without tripping over Michael Nutter or go to a block party without seeing either Tom Knox or someone from his campaign there. Shoot, I have been to two political related holiday parties and Nutter was at both. It was nice to see.

But, aside from my crude joke, I gave him props for what he has done. If you didn't see it, it's briefly there, trust me.

At the same time, I, personally, happen to think that integrity means something--even over policy sometimes. Like--how I couldn't imagine voting for Mark Cohen or Babette when I knew they took the payraise too and should have suffered the consequences (especially for all those books, Mr. Cohen). But, I know I am in the minority here and I digress. So, to the extent it is or isn't a distraction, I guess that is really a subjective determination.

more on integrity - American Royalty

"Forget waiting lists. Next time I need a shiny red Lexus SC 430 convertible or a pair of LV pumps shipped from the Paris boutique, I’ll get ’em right quick via the personal concierges at ¬American Royalty. 800-570-0235; americanroyalty.com. "

http://www.phillymag.com/shopping_style/articles/philadelphia_magazine_h...

Kind of a fishy business for the son of a U.S. Congressman to be in. If Curt Weldon's daughter had run a business like this, who knows what peeps from Russia would have been "buying" through their "personal concierge" in PhiladelphiaChester County.

Guess I should bite my tongue before I risk saying anything "reckless."

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Phillyville

And... just to make clear.

I am sure if Curt Weldon's daughter did run a "personal concierge" service, peeps on this board would be all up in arms about the impropriety of it all.

I'm just saying, the fact that the $15K unpaid bill and what not caused nary a ripple on this site sure makes it seem like some of us could be guilty of applying a double standard.

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Phillyville

Congratulations

Congratulations Rubylegs,

You have discovered us!

Yes, a Congressman steering contracts to his daughter is the same as Chaka's child starting some business where it looks like his son screwed up. Maybe I didn't mention it because I don't think its newsworthy in any way.

"Get Down or Lay Down"

$15K unpaid bills incurred by some sketchy business run by the son of a U.S. Congressman is newsworthy.

This is Philadelphia. The mayor's brother just got indicted. Before that, his attorney, Ron White, got indicted. A bug was placed in the mayor's office because of the Mayor's ties to Shamsud-din Ali and all the drug stuff Ali was wrapped up in. And if you don't think that's relevant to the next mayoral election, you've got blinders on.

I respect the your desire to make this forum about the "issues." However, unless you're an ostrich, the issue for 2007 is corruption. If Philadelphia ends up with another Street administration, we're screwed. And, from my perspective, Fattah and American Royalty just looks like more of the same.

In 2003, Fattah stood up, "spun the shit" and put his name on the line on behalf of John Street. Fattah followed it up with $200,000 campaign donations and $15K unpaid bills rung up by his son's sketchy business. Fattah is the status quo.

The way I see it, you're never going to address the poverty problem until you do something about all the leeches that currently run this city. And, whether or not Fattah is legally "corrupt," he is definitely part of the bathwater. And as long as there are other decent mayoral candidates out there, I'm definitely willing to throw out the odd baby with said bathwater.

Like Corey Kemp said, "this is the time to either get down or lay down."

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Phillyville

whose problem?

However, unless you're an ostrich, the issue for 2007 is corruption.

I dunno Ruby, not a single poll that I have seen supports this statement. Do you mean that this is the most important issue to YOU or is there some broader support that I just don't see?

Before anyone gets into a tizzy I am not saying that corruption is NOT a problem, I just don't know that a majority of Philadelphians name it as the most important issue and I honestly don't know if I think "corruption" (such a nebulous term) actually impedes policy-makers' ability to be productive.

Can you explain in quantative terms how your perception of corruption impacts the ability of Council and the Mayor to address crime, drugs, education and jobs (the issues I have consistently seen in polling as the most important to Philadelphians)?

Cute quotes aside, what are

Cute quotes aside, what are you basing this on? Using someone's kids seemingly dumb move just makes it look like you are grasping for straws. Do you honestly not see a huge difference between Weldon's daughter, Milton Street, and this?

And, as Ray said- I suppose if anything is THE issue I think it is gun violence that consistently polls number 1. Which isn't to say corruption isn't important- because I think it is- but- 1)it isn't THE issue, 2)there is no indication whatsoever of ANY corruption on his part.

I do not know about the

I do not know about the polling numbers, and I agree most with Dan and (gasp) Ray (jk). But, one thing that Ruby says is true is that without a change in terms of getting the business as usual folks out of office, we will likely not solve a thing. Just look at the entire current administration, who in my opinion has not accomplished all that much in 8 years. I was excited about NTI at first, and operation sunrise. But, since then, I can't think of anything particularly noteworthy. If I am incorrect, please let me know.

gasp!

Gaetano, we used to agree more in the good old days...where did the love go?

Anyway, I understand the sentiment behind your agreement with Ruby, which I tried to articulate too...but it is getting sort of useless/rhetorical the way that we just reference "corruption" without actually defining its impact.

The city is surely ineffcient--as an employer trying to get ahold of someone to answer my wage tax questions I can tell you that--but is that the result of corruption? I mean at the end of the day, trash gets picked up, streets are cleaned, schools open, libraries give out books, etc.

My question is if city leaders can at least make sure the trash gets picked up, why can't they figure out how to create good jobs? or improve the schools? or end violence?

Is it because of corruption or stupidity? Or fear?

That's why I'd like Ruby to quantify the impact of corruption.

Seriously, Ray

Do you mean to say that you don't see how selling influence causes inefficiencies in City operations? When political support is bought, and voters' needs/wishes/interests are disenfranchised, voters lose faith in the system because they don't believe that their votes have meaning, and politicians are able to maintain power without being held accountable. Which is why city services in our city are so bad.

Just what are you arguing here? What is the relevance of saying that violence in our streets is more important than ridding our government of corruption?

If you want to make the case that Fattah is the most progressive candidate, go for it - but I'm not getting the downplaying of the relative importance of having honest representative government.

read more carefully

I don't know why whenever the issue of "corruption" is broght up it becomes an all or nothing kind of thing. As I have now stated pretty clearly twice in this thread, of course corruption--the act of taking moeny or peddling influence for personal gain to the detriment of the common good--is bad.

However, as MCD spells out below and as my own personal experince with city and state government as a citizen and as a professional working on public policy support, a lack of accountability and a lack of effiencieny seem to be the cause of many more problems in the city than corruption.

My experience is by no means extensive, so i am honestly very open to hearing more, but the problem of corruption needs to be quantified for me more than it has been.

Further, polls of voters by a variety of sources say that while ethics and corruption are on voters minds, they are by no means as important to voters as public policy makers' ability to do something about crime, education, violence and jobs.

I bring this point up again because Ruby said that corruption will be THE issue in 2007, and while that may be the case of some folks here, it is not so far the feeling of the majority of Philadelphians.

I would posit that it is

I would posit that it is entirely impossible to "quantify" the net effects on policy and quality of life related to corruption. I simply do not know how you can go around quantifying something that didn't exist (measures, law, etc.), it's kind of like prooving a negative. But, to the extent those of us look at corruption, lack of accountability and complete inefficiency can be quantified--how about like this--everything we think we should have, including better public transit, safer streets, a decent school system or departments that run smoothly that is not happening is related to one of those three things. Or, to the extent we see things that even Camden, NJ has (a riverfront with a light rail line), New York, Boston, etc., have and we don't seem to--one of the above. Sometimes, I am really amazed that given some of our leadership we are as well of as we are (which isn't great).

If you can share how we can scientifically quantify these issues, I would be more than willing to look for the data.

Yes--I realize I combined the three, but I think they all need to be together.

I'm not trying to be flip.

Here's the thing though: New Jersey state government--which is funded the River Line--is by all accounts totally corrupt.

And Chicago is another example.

Corruption sucks, but it exists in other places where good stuff still manages to happen.

So I am answering your question with a question. How do you quantify the impact of corruption on a city whose public policy output is worse than other corrupt places (as much as corruption is defined by perception and reputation since we can't seem to quantify it).

did i just repeat your point?

sorry. i think i maybe just restated your point.

which still leaves us fucked and answerless.

Chicago is not as corrupt as Philly

mostly because the machine in Chicago is unified and corruption is kept under some control. Chicago is much better governed for the same reason. Here in Philly we have such a factionalized party that each faction spends all its time fighting the others and each one of the factions can stop any new public policy initiative that might hurt it. In Chicago, the Mayor / Chair of the Cook County Democratic Party has much more control over the city and can force through compromise deals that benefit all factions in the long term even if it hurts many of them in the short term.

This, by the way, is the best reason for thinking that Bob Brady might actually accomplish things as Mayor that no one else could. But he would have to hang on to his position as party Chair.

We are still waiting, howver, to find out what Brady would want to accomplish, as we mostly are for Fattah as well. (Brady did endorse the Committee of Seventy Ethics proposal, however.)

Isn't the ideal Mayoral candidate a composite of the real, existing candidates? Dwight Evan's vision of economic development and crime reduction, Michael Nutter's vision of clean government, John Dougherty's vision of public works as a path to prosperity, Chaka Fattah's ability to sell a public policy in public and Bob Brady's ability to sell it to the party leaders and Council. (I don't know Tom Knox well enough to include him.)

One reason we can't find a consensus among progressives about the Mayor's race is that our candidates have such different virtues. I think we would all agree about the virtues of each candidate, but we can't agree upon which ones are most important to us.

When does accoutability become an issue?

You all are having an interesting debate (did this thread break the record for comments?) but I think there are two issues that really matter, aside from the entire freak out over violence.

While corruption per say has a cost in terms of an unfair playing field for businesses, I'd agree with Ray and Dan that it's not all consuming.

The real issue--and I'm not seeing it debated--is accountability. There are too many city employees that don't do anything worthwhile or meaningful all day long (and I understand if you disagree because it's not as satisfying as fighting poverty but when it increases the tax burden or detracts from funding better programs, it needs to be discussed) and just as importantly, the bureaucracy is full of fiefdoms and power struggles that don't coordinate city services. This is what city residents are paying for? Please.

Lastly, I'd say that Fattah Jr. actions (while not impacting Fattah qualifications as a candidate) are indicative of something else that is TOO common in this city for those who are politically connected: a sense of entitlement. I personally think that sense of entitlement needs to stop.

--------
When hope begins to challenge despair, the possibility of change begins.
Disclosure: I'm leaning towards supporting Michael Nutter in the Mayor's race.

Ethics

The way I see it, it's all chicken and egg.

a lack of accountability leads to a sense of entitlement that leads to corruption which leads to a lack of accountability that leads to a sense of entitlement which leads to corruption...

As for quantification, I've sat around many a table and listened to Neil Oxman's canned rant that is entirely premised on his data that shows voters sick of the status quo in Philadelphia. I don't remember how he exactly phrases it - he did an extensive interview that you can listen to on NPR's website that runs through his entire schtick. But, the way he tells it, his polls tell him the determinative issue is not guns or education or any specific issue centric policy other than Philadelphia is run by a bunch of bums that need to be thrown out on the street.

And, as for Weldon v. Milton v. Fattah Jr. critique, my response is quite simple - ethics are not relative. Unethical behavior is unethical whether $15K or $15M are at stake.

I'd argue, the only distinguishing characteristic of the two acts is hubris.

And don't tell me that the two acts can be distinguished because one is legal and the other was illegal. As you - Dan - are a future lawyer and card carrying "Progressive," I suspect that you already understand that the legality of an actor's unethical behavior is determined only by the quality of the actor's legal representation.

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Phillyville

I agree, Ruby

I fail to see how distinguishing corruption and a lack of accountability is anything other than a false dichotomy. I get that "ethics" may not be at the top of everyone's list, and I get that it is theoretically possible to have a corrupt city government and still get the trains to run on time - but I think that pay-to-play goes hand-in-hand with a lack of accountability in this City.

That said, I get the feelng that your anti-BPT focus will motivate you to accuse Fattah as being responsible for everything bad - up to and including the heartbreak of psoriasis.

Just curious, what do you like about Nutter other than his perspective on the BPT?

Causation and Correlation

I assume from the tone of your post that you personally don't deal with the city much. For the folks who do, and need a permit from L and I or a wage tax question answered on the phone or need a pothole filled, Milton Street's airport contract doesn't really matter.

The "culture of pay-to-play," has been in no way scientifically quantified (with cold hard numbers to look at that indicate what % of contracts are awarded due to special favors not to mention that we have no long-term trends here to see if more favors were offered by Rizzo, Green, Goode, Rendell or Street). Again, I am not naive, I am sure some bad stuff has happened, but I don't think that eliminating it will solve the problems of inefficiency and lack of accountability that can be experienced in almost any interaction with city government.

So it's not dichotomous to name corruption and inefficiency and lack of accountability differently--of course these problems overlap--but there are different causes and effects for them.

So, I will state for a 3rd (or is 4th time) can anyone quantify Ruby's point and tell me how exactly "corruption" makes it impossible for policy makers to deliver change on crime/violence, jobs, and education? When I first asked this question, I was honestly hoping for an answer. Now I am pretty sure I am only go get more rhetoric...which is kind of sad.

I guess we're talking about "semantics"

"For the folks who do, and need a permit from L and I or a wage tax"

Believe me, I've done my share of waiting in impossibly long lines at L&I, and for long hours trying to get through to city services on the phone.

"The "culture of pay-to-play," has been in no way scientifically quantified "

I think that's a good point, and speaking of Goode, I think some of his challenges to the perceived prevalence of pay-to-play have been instructive. I have no reason to believe that there has been any more pay-to-play under Street than there was under Rendell, let alone Rizzo (under whom I would guess there was considerably more PTP). I am quite leary of the rabble-rousing around "ethics," and skeptical about attempts to portray Nutter as the "reform" candidate.

But I guess I just see the near total lack of accountability as being an extension of "corruption," and addressing corruption as being the same thing as addressing accountability. I consider a government system wherein people aren't held into account to do their jobs efficiently AND politicians stay in office regardless - through blatant patronage and a de facto Tammany Hall type of political machine that disenfranchises voters (a la insiders appointed to City Council slots) - to be a "corrupt" government system. In using that term I mean more than just graft or politicians enriching themselves personally.

OK, enough beating this dead horse.

Pay to Play

While I enjoy finding stats or case studies as much as probably anyone here, I doubt that any case studies or stats exist for the cost of pay to play. That is because there is no scientific or statistical study that can be done on this or a before or after study as the issue is very murky and when and where pay to play actually occurs or does not occur cannot be empirically shown in nearly any case. Ergo, you are likely never going to see stats or a study. That does not mean that pay to play or corruption does not exist. In terms of corruption and inefficiency and lack of accountability, while there may not be a direct nexus among them in some or many of most cases, I believe they are all in the same basket and overlap to some degree. I will close with the point that the fact that pay to play does occur to some degree in Philadelphia and it contributes to the dynamics, culture and mentality of local government. While corruption does not make it impossible to deliver policy change on crime, jobs, education, it certainly does not encourage or establishes an evironment for progressive, creative and dynamic leadership and envisioning that results in change.

BINGO! Waiting around for a

BINGO!

Waiting around for a quantification will get you know where.

The Politics of Fear and the Costs of Corruption

There are all kinds of corruption in the city. And Ray is right that some of them just cost a little, or perhaps a lot of, money. And other kinds systematically undermine the way the city operates.

We do have some indication of the costs of pay to play, for example. Joe Hoeffel pointed out last year that when he was a commissioner in Montgomery County, they started to bid out most legal work such as bond work. And their legal bills dropped—unfortunately I can’t remember the exact amount—either in half or by two-thirds.

If someone had the time and energy, they could pore over the transcripts of the recent trials and start quantifying other costs. Ron White’s girlfriend had a printing “business” that owned no presses. It basically served as a contractor to the airport and hired other companies that actually did the printing. And then she padded the printing bills by 50% over she was charged by the real printer. That might have cost the airport a few hundred thousand dollars over the course of the year.
But Ray is also right, I think, in pointing out that the deeper problem in the city is not money wasted—although we certainly could use that money—but that city agencies are unresponsive to the public and act in arbitrary and an unfair manner.

Some examples:

L&I doesn’t always come when called; it doesn’t follow up on cases it opens; and it doesn’t seem to enforce the law fairly.
To get action, it helps to have a ward leader or council member make a call for you. And those same calls often protect business owners from enforcement. There is an egregious example I know of a car dealership that has a totally illegal, brightly lit sign that L&I can’t seem to get removed.

The zoning process is also thoroughly politicized. District Council members and, sometimes, ward leaders, have a tremendous influence on which variances are granted and which are not. And since our crazy-quilt zoning code almost makes a variance mandatory before anything gets built, zoning decisions are made in ways that are highly arbitrary.

The process for getting licenses to open a new business is another example. Smart businessmen hire “expediters” and “consultants” to grease the wheels of the machinery of the city.

The process by which vacant land is made available to potential developers is another example. There is no one place to find out what land the city owns. Getting that information usually requires political connections. And political considerations largely determine why one potential developer rather than another gets site control over city owned properties. There is rarely any bidding process.

Whenever a political system is in place that is unfair, dysfunctional and annoying to many citizens we need to ask ourselves why it has not been changed. Why has every mayoral candidate in the last twenty years said that he would fix the regulatory process and nothing has happened?

My view is that the way this city works is functional, for Council members and, to some extent, ward leaders. Whether we are individuals, homeowners, businessmen, or community groups, getting what we need from the city requires us to make a special deal with a member of Council or a ward leader. We thus become dependent on them. And some of us vote for them, or give them campaign contributions, because of the special deals we get.

And I use the word “us” deliberately. As a leader of a community organization, I have played my role in this system. So has every other effective community activist in the city. Those of us who want to improve our neighborhoods are enablers of this system and not just because we provide tacit or active support for the Council members who help us.

We also take on much of the role that an effective government would be providing: we police the streets in town watches; we report on potholes; we represent neighborhood interests in zoning and development disputes and so forth. It is a good thing that we play this role. A good municipal government should involve its citizens in the administration of public policy. The problem, however, is that we play this role not primarily by interacting with apolitical administrative agencies that should be encouraging citizen involvement. Instead we work through Council members and the party. And that means we get further enmeshed with them.

I have been calling this system a politics of fear, because it leaves us dependent on, and fearful of our political leaders.

It is a very bad system.

Why is it bad?

First, it is unfair to individuals and neighborhoods. Individuals and neighborhoods that have political connections or know how to create them do well. Those who don’t, suffer. And, as you would expect, class and race play a large role in determining which neighborhoods do well and which suffer. As I have been traveling around the city, I have seen that some neighborhoods have to put up with things—the lack of enforcement of city laws; unwanted development shoved down their throat—that I would never tolerate when I was president of West Mt. Airy Neighbors.

Second, it balkanizes the city. Our attachment to our neighborhoods is one of the best things about Philadelphia. But in politics, it keep us focused too much how to serve our narrow interests—and in making sure we get a larger share of some limited resource, like police protection, than some other neighborhood. We should be thinking more about how we can improve the city—and create more resources—for everyone.

And, third, it enables our political leaders to get reelected even though most of them they are not trying to find innovative public policies that would benefit all of us. The politics of fear is the main reason that Philadelphia is twenty to fifty years behind other cities in the country and the world in so many public policy areas, from crime to transportation to economic development to affordable housing to zoning and development to taxation

We have to end this politics of fear. As some you have heard me say, we have to create a politics of hope. We have to encourage our citizens to believe that real change is possible, to think that there are solutions to the problems that afflict every neighborhood, and to demand that their political officials offer such solutions,
Ray is right that people care about the problems that affect their lives, more than they care about issues of good government. But I have discovered that they understand the connection between the politics of fear and the lack of good government. They are angry about it. And they want to believe that politics in Philadelphia can be better. They really want a politics of hope.

We will find out whether this message can generate a movement for political change and can elect candidates for office that want to change our politics.

I’m betting the next four months of my life that is can.

What Marc Said... and 311

First off, it would be freaking amazing if Marc gets elected and we can have someone who is capable of writing with his clarity and intelligence working on behalf of all Phiiladelphia.

Second, I'd just like to add one little point - it's about the customer service mindset of city workers. They view ward leaders and politicians as their customers. They view the average joes and josephines who walk in as an inconvenience. City workers have this mindset because of a corrupt system - one that rewards political support with civil service jobs. City workers need to be made accountable to taxpayers and not ward leaders.

A 311 system that effectively holds individual city workers accountable to the people they are supposed to serve would go a long way to fixing the accountability problem and disincentivizing the city workers participation in a corrupt system. So would electing leaders who themselves hold themselves accountable to taxpayers rather than the handful of folks who wrote six-figure campaign donations.
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Phillyville

311 and 411 ... Why did Marc give me money?

I totally support the 311 system ... it will go a long way in reforming "constituent services" and its politicization. Jim had a very effective hearing on the issue.

But just for the sake of dialogue, note that Marc supported my reelection campaign financially in 2003 (thank you, again).

Was it the politics of fear - or hope?

WWGjr

It was the politics of fear, of course

I was invited by Farah Jimenez, the executive director of Mt. Airy USA on whose board I sit. She (and I) supported you because you had introduced legislation that provided tax benefits for businesses that gave contributions to CDCs. We were desperate for city support for the work of CDCs and your bill helped. Given what I knew at the time--and given my enormous respect for your father who I met via Maurice Clifford who was a family friend--it seemed reasonable at the time to support you.

By the way, your bill to help CDCs was not enough, though. CDCs could be very effective in rehabilitating commerical corridors and building housing if they had much more support from the city and if the process of getting that support were not so crazy. OARC, the CDC, Dwight Evans set up (and which has brought millions of dollars into West Oak Lane and created about 1200 jobs) rarely uses City money because it is too little and too hard to get.

I also didn't like the funding mechanism you set up as it creates a back door way of funding something that should be funded through the font door. A transparent city administration would provide direct aid to CDCs instead of giving businesses a tax credit for the dollars they contribute. And why should we allow giant corporations to decide which CDCs are worthy of support and which are not.

As readers of this blog know, I have never failed to give you credit for the work you have done on some issues, such as helping minorities and women get access to credit.

But I would have to say that your unwillingness to move forward with reform of the city is going to hamper that work.

For example, the idea of a bond issue that will provide funds for improving our commerical corridors is a good one. I have been calling for this for a few years, as have you.

But I would have voted against the bond issue you proposed because it didn't include a new mechanism for distributing the money. The money is likely to be spent like NTI money, under the heavy influence of district Council members. And instead of supporting those CDCs that are effective and cutting off those that are not, some district Council members are going to give it to their political allies and keep it from their (perceived) enemies. And so we are going waste a ton of money.

And, the other reason I wouldn't vote for or contribute to you again is that more often than not you have stood in the way of real political reform. You oppose public financing of campaigns. And I learned not too long ago that this has been true for a while. Angel Ortiz proposed a very good public financing bill five or so years ago and you voted against it in committee, after promising to support it.

And, as readers of YPP know, more recently you supported a definition of candidate for the campaign finance laws that created a major loophole in them. And, once again, after saying that you would support an amendment that would tighten the laws, you didn't do what you said you would.

Marc and Wilson: Chill!

Do I need to get out a ruler?

Wilson Goode is easily one of the most progressive at-large Council members. Marc is easily one of the most well-known progressive leaders in the city.

Wilson: you have done things on Council and supported legislation that i woudl not.

Marc: you have supported bills and organizations that I would not.

However, differences aside, you would both be valuable assets to the 2007-2011 City Council. There are almost 20 other people running besides you two--why don't you focus on them--most of whom should not be on Council--than each other.

STOP SNIPING AT EACH OTHER! IT"S STUPID!

Oh Please, Ray

The vast majority of the things Wilson and I have been discussing are substantive policy issues. He has sniped at me and, in self-defense, I've sniped back. But since the New Year, he has kept what evidently was a resolution and has been focusing on substantive political and policy issues and I have responded in kind. (I am a little biased, but I think our discussion race and politics was pretty enlightening.) And we have both said nice things about one another as well.

I think Wilson asking me why I supported him once before and now would not is a perfectly legitimate question and I gave a serious answer. Whatever his flaws, Wilson is a serious legislator and I'm taking him seriously. Since you own the site and are making threats, I'm just going to leave it to others to decide whether Wilson is responding to me in the same way or another way.

And then there is the pot and kettle issue. How about we make a deal. I won't make another criticism of Wilson until you next criticize Michael Nutter.

Marc

PS I'm curious. What organizations and bills have I supported that you would not?

answer

the david cohen tax relief bill for low-income folks. its' been discussed on the blog before, so go dig around if you want to see my position.

and, as for organizations, well...we'll leave that left unsaid.

Cohen Wage Tax Relief

I assume you opposed delaying the implementation of the Cohen wage tax relief bill since I was one of the people fighting for it last year. (The search function on this site doesn't seem to work very well and I couldn't find your entries about it.)

For those who don't recall: the Cohen wage tax bill allows people with low incomes to get a rebate on their wage tax. When fully implemented it would be a cut in about half the wage tax for people making very low incomes.

It is by no means an ideal solution because a significant number of people will not apply for it in the first few years the program is in operation. But over five years, if non-profits were hard to make people aware of the rebate, we estimate that 70 to 80% of the people eligible for the program will take part.

Last year, Mayor Street forced Council to push back the implementation of the program by two years on the grounds that it would cost the city too much revenue and would leave the five year plan (for fiscal years 2007-2011) unbalanced. We argued, correctly, that because it would take some years for people to make full use of the program, the Mayor was overestimating the cost of the program by a factor of 4 or 5. But Council politics stood in the way: the Mayor basically told district council people that he would cut money from their recreation centers and close fire houses if they didn't vote to delay implementation of the program.

There are two problems with the wage tax rebate:

1. Because it is not automatic but something people have to apply for--like the Federal Earned Income Tax Credti, a lot of people who could use it will not make use of it. Unfortunately, until the uniformity clause is removed from our state constitution, we can't institute a true, progressive wage (or personal income) tax.

2. It will cost the city revenues.

Those are both good arguments. I have been calling for revenue neutral tax reform, and thus had some qualms about the Cohen wage tax rebate. But my reasons for supporting it were first, if there is room to cut the BPT, there is room to cut wage taxes on the poorest citizens; second that giving low income citizens lower taxes is actually a good economic development program for our worst off commercial corridors; and third that the wage tax rebate might be a good bargaining chip when we have a serious and comprehensive discussion about the tax structure in the city, which I hope we will see in 2008.

And then there was a sentimental reason--this was David Cohen's last major piece of legislation.

By the way--and for those of you who think that my criticisms of Wilson are motivated by nothing besides politics--I want top point out that, if I recall correctly, both Wilson Goode and Jim Kenny voted against delaying the implementation of the Cohen wage tax rebate.

The Education of Marc Stier - his own "Pay to Play" !

If you did your homework...

you would know that I've passed several pieces of community economic development legislation, not just the tax credit program. In fact, the tax credit program was introduced with two other measures that became law:

1) Allocating a % of CDBG funds on an annual basis to CDC economic development - the first guaranteed funding stream.

2) Appointing the Philadelphia Association of CDCs to the City's Vacant Property Review Committee - the first non-governmental organization.

Didn't Farah tell you that before you wrote the check?

And if you did your homework ...

you would know that I've always had doubts about public financing of campaigns and always publicly voiced them ... and I've never driven without a driver's license.

Lastly, but again, if you did your homework ...

you would know that there was an incentive for municipal candidates that were not big fans of contribution limits to declare within 2006 because the limits are ANNUAL limits. I realized that, you didn't.

But the biggest point is ... why did you give me money if you didn't do your research?

And was that "pay to play" for you as a board member of a city-funded agency?

I think you said, "YES". But now you're reformed?

WWGjr

um

i don't like being ignored...and the name of this blog is not goodstierdukeitout.com.

the grudge match shit better stop soon or else...

PEACE

WWGjr

Sniping

Agreed. As a newbie who is still in the ranks of the undecided, I would wager I represent a sizable bloc of readers. And this exchange looks and feels a) personal; b) less than fully relevant and c) like politics as usual. Both of you have distinguished yourselves to date by a willingness to stay above the fray, and a reluctance to sink into the morass of acronyms and name-dropping that marginalizes the average Philadelphian from these conversations. I would tie this thread into a tidy knot and move on.

Acronyms? What's wrong with acronyms?

They can be quite useful.

And don't tell me that the

And don't tell me that the two acts can be distinguished because one is legal and the other was illegal. As you - Dan - are a future lawyer and card carrying "Progressive," I suspect that you already understand that the legality of an actor's unethical behavior is determined only by the quality of the actor's legal representation.

Nice straw man. Did I say that, at all? Nope.

No, my argument is pretty simple. The only evidence you have here is that a 23 year old kid started a business, and he appeared to screw up. This is staggeringly different than Milton Street getting a public contract for 360k a year at the airport to do nothing.

You are grasping at straws. Honestly, all that BS does is make me think you are incredibly insecure about why you want Nutter, and don't want Fattah.

look - I'd be happy to call your opinion BS - but I don't

You said 15K is a "screw up" - great.

Shit, I've screwed up some but I've never skipped on a bar tab, LET ALONE A 15K BAR TAB!!!

In my opinion, stiffing a restaurant for 15K is unethical. Combined with the fact that he is the son of a U.S. Congressman who comports himself in a manner that shows a distinct lack of ethics (for example, accepting $200K campaign donations, suing to have campaign finance laws over turned, and misrepresenting his personal education record) suggests to me an overall pattern of unethical behavior.

To be honest, I find the mere idea of Fattah Jr. running a luxury concierge service to be extremely shady. After all, where does a 23-year old son of a congressman get the cash to fund this kind of operation?

If you're willing to call my opinion "BS," so be it. We obviously are coming at the "ethics" issue from different starting points.

______________________________
Phillyville

And

If Neil Oxman said it, it must be true:

Here is the same poll that we in theory are talking about in this post:

More importantly, crime is still issue No. 1. In fact, the release says the pollster "was astonished at the magnitude of identification of violent crime as the top issue."

When asked an open-ended question about what issue was the most important one for the city, "nearly two-thirds of those polled – said murder, violent crime or gun violence was the top problem for City officials. ... Public corruption, jobs and school performance trail distantly at 7% a piece.

Could this be overstated? Sure. But, clearly, gun violence,etc. is number 1.

But...

You raise an issue of who is being polled. Are we polling the regular electorate, who (1) likely have not experienced corruption directly, thus their only experience is anecdotal or based on the latest Inquirer article, and (2) are not sophisticated enough to make a critical analysis on the complexities of public finance or conflicts of interest. Or are we polling business owners who base their decision whether or not to start a billion dollar project in this city on its perceived pay to play atmosphere? If you want "hard numbers" ask developers or business people whether they base their decisions whether to spend money on perceived corruption in city government. Balance it against risk and expectation on return and you may have your numbers (at least as far as lost investment capital, maybe not wasted man hours due to redundant or superfluous employees).

If someone says issue X is

If someone says issue X is "THE" issue in the election, I will presume they mean Philadelphia voters. Ie, those who go into the voting booth and decide who to put into office.

It's about more than "Snow Removal in a Blizzard".

In every poll that has been taken recently and in the near future, "crime and violence" is the #1 issue and probably will remain at the top.

But what if the question wasn't about the top issue facing the city - but the #1 concern that voters face in their individual lives on a daily basis?

And what if the answers to both questions were different - but interrelated?

Then, guess what?

Then we could have a focused public policy debate on priorities for this city's future - and I think we eventually will.

But until we collectively realize that the #1 issue is not the only issue - but interrelated to many issues - our electoral choices will be based on politics, and not policy.

If the #1 issue in the city is driven by a rise in the number of "young black men killing other young black men", shouldn't the public policy response address young black men in a constructive manner? Yes.

And might that address the public policy priorities of most voters? Probably not.

So is that what people will vote for? Some.

We have to address this "crisis" in multiple ways that are related to other public policy priorities- and recognize that effective governing is about more than crisis management.

We shouldn't necessarily elect the person who's best at "snow removal in a blizzard" - but the person who can positively impact our daily quality of life and effectively "remove snow in a blizzard".

And above all, don't elect anyone who claims that their leadership can stop "blizzards" - because since when does it "snow" in only one political jurisdiction?

I agree with Fattah's premise that the issue of "crime and violence" must be de-politicized - both the root causes and the societal impact are too serious to be used as part of a political game.

WWGjr

Delaware County

Its Delaware County.

But, seriously, unless you have some weird evidence (of which I cannot imagine) that Fattah did anything wrong whatsoever, take that shit elsewhere. We are not a gossip column, and I am not interested in trashing someone's family on this site. His son is not running for office, he is.

Fattah?

Besides the scholarship funds, what has Fattah done for public education in Philadelphia? I'm asking seriously, as it's something that I care very deeply about.

The truth about Fattah's personal educational record

Chaka Fattah has not lied about his education. For example, the exact truth of his educational record is exactly what he said about it when he announced for Mayor. The transcript is at http://www.phillyforfattah.com/speech.asp.

For your edification and convenience, here is the relevant section:

If I have learned one lesson in life so far, it's this: nothing worth while is easy. There are always challenges and obstacles. I have had them in my own life.

I earned a Commonwealth Equivalency Diploma rather than finishing at Overbrook High School. It was an alternative route, but I didn't quit. At 19, I had to stop taking classes at Community College because I became a young father and my main concern was caring for my new family.

But with each twist and turn of life, Philadelphia was there to give me another opportunity to get ahead. This city provided me with the home court advantage to transfer from Community College to the University of Pennsylvania. And even though I didn't get my undergraduate degree at Penn, the Fels School of Government took a chance by admitting me and I stand before you as a graduate with a Masters Degree that I earned.

If you want more, please feel free to visit the Inquirer archives for a Peter Nicholas article from September 3, 2002.

Here are some excerpts:

Fattah's academic path was by no means a conventional one. He attended Overbrook High School in West Philadelphia in the early 1970s but did not graduate. He earned a general equivalency diploma administered by the state. He did undergraduate work at the community college in 1974-75, and then in 1976-77 attended the Community Wharton Education Program, a college-prep program aimed at minority students that has since closed. He never received a college diploma, he said, having financial responsibilities as a young father.

Fattah says he was inspired to further his education after attending a three-week program at Harvard's John F. Kennedy School of Government in 1984. The program was for senior executives in state and local government, and Fattah had been nominated for it by the speaker of the Pennsylvania House.

After earning a certificate from the program, he decided not to go back for his undergraduate degree but, instead, to pursue a master's.

"I was a parent of two children at that point," he said. "I was a state legislator of some note. I went to Harvard and I had learned something that I had not known prior to going to the Kennedy School, which is that you could go to school and study those things you were actually interested in vs. what others wanted you to study.

Fattah had heard about a graduate program in government at the University of Pennsylvania. He spoke to James A. Spady, the director of the Fels Center of Government at the time, who says he was impressed with Fattah and wanted to admit him. But Fattah's academic credentials were a bit of a sticking point. A college diploma is not a formal requirement at Fels. Still, it was rare to admit students without a degree, Spady said, so he consulted a deputy in the provost's office.

"I felt he was going places, and you have to remember the mission was to improve the public sector through people," Spady said in an interview.

"I don't want to drag race into it, but here's what I thought was one of the four or five most promising young black guys in the Philadelphia area asking to go into the program."

Fattah was admitted on the condition he show he could do the work. By all accounts, he did well as a student. A transcript he made public shows he got A's and B's, and he graduated in 1986.Fattah, who was elected to Congress in 1994, said his career success vindicates the choice to let him enroll.

"One could argue Fels is correct - that I could play a significant role in public policy and that additional educational experience might aid me in that regard," he said.

Please feel free to email me, eloeb@phillyforfattah.com, or call the campaign at 215-829-1620 if you have any questions.

Eric Loeb, PhD
Director of Technology
Fattah for Mayor
http://www.phillyforfattah.com/

If this is true, great! I

If this is true, great! I would admire him even more as it was obviously earned the hard way. Still needs to convince me for my vote.

The claim is that he lied for over a decade before coming clean.

Eric,
With all due respect, I don't think the issue is whether Fattah has lied recently about his education. He started coming clean after Jerry Mondesire did some digging, created a web site and told the papers that his resume was suspect. But you can put this question to rest not by posting his recent statements, but rather posting the resumes and bios that he used during the 1990's and early 2000's. It was in that period of time where people claim that Fattah was presenting himself as someone he was not. Recent statements from his current web site don't cut it.

Ruby-are you saying

Ruby-are you saying integrity should matter?

I know I am in the 20% undecided. But, I'd like to see some substance soon from these guys.

Gaetano - you kill me

yeah, I'd like to think integrity is something peeps should look for in a candidate - especially considering the circumstances of Philadelphia government.

I have a feeling I'm getting set up for something here. So go ahead and tell me why Nutter has no integrity or something...
______________________________
Phillyville

No. Not being set up.

No. Not being set up. Sarcasim.

ahh, didn't see your comment

ahh, didn't see your comment above.

______________________________
Phillyville

Come on, Ruby, I would have

Come on, Ruby, I would have sent you an email heads up first.

PEG not PEL

Just for the record, the poll was commissioned by Pennsylvanians for Effective Government, a pro-business political action committee, not PEL, a public policy think tank. I had an email exchange with someone who has had some experience analyzing poll numbers from various polling outfits and he said that while he generally considers Susquehanna Polling & Research of Harrisburg to be suspect, this polling sample actually seemed accurate.

His whole comment is on the Next Mayor blog, here.

Anyway, the numbers aren't much different from any of the previous polls and still seem to be based on name recognition. While we may have all heard of Bob Brady, it wouldn't surprise me if a lot of folks in Philly haven't... even among likely voters.

Thanks for the correction. I

Thanks for the correction. I would encourage everyone to check out Dan's link. Pretty interesting stuff.

---
http://benwaxman.com

Fattah vs. Brady

I think Fattah's strong showing in this poll is at least partly explained by his early announcement. A "likely voter" might know that Fattah is running, but it appears to be a very small group that thinks Congressman Brady will run. That makes a difference.

It also says "Congressman Bob Brady has an 85% name ID with 39% favorable and 16% unfavorable, 30% aware, but no opinion," compared to this sentence for Fattah: "Congressman Chaka Fattah is known by 95% of the respondents,” said Patti, “and 63% have a favorable perception of him compared to only 13% who have an unfavorable view.” (19% are “aware” of Fattah, but have no opinion of him.)" There is a lot of growing room there for Brady.

Also, I think it is necessary to be very careful about interpreting the racial breakdown. This was a small poll -- 500 people I think -- and they talked to 48% white voters which gives all of those estimates a margin of error of something like 7-8 points.

Beyond all of this, it is just too early to declare a "consensus candidate" when not all of them have declared and there is such high undecided numbers.

I agree. It is entirely too

I agree. It is entirely too early to start talking about consensus. This year will be devisive and bitter. No reason to sugar coat it. If one does, however, emerge I will agree then.

As for now, my favorables of the ones declared are only Nutter and Evans. I do not like Fattah at this point. Since Brady hasn't declared, I can't say. My wife likes Tom Knox right now. He has an interesting story.

I love these polls. Who

I love these polls. Who exactly are they polling?
I'm an active voter. Why haven't I ever been polled or questioned about candidates..ever?

I look at it this way: Chakka Fattah might have name recognition in his area and with the black voters. But due to his allegience- or sympathy-- with mumia abu jamal, that will hurt him with alot of unions such as police and firefighters..all of whom have family, children, friends who vote--and who will certainly show up at the polls against him.

My prediction is Bob Brady throws his hat in the ring at the last minute, and blows them all away.
I'll take Bob Brady over Chakka Fattah anyday. My first choice would be Michael Nutter. 2nd- Tom Knox.
A win-win would be a combination of the above 3 in important positions within city government that could actually make an impact.

Blatent Racism

Wow. There is so much wrong with this post that I barely know where to start. Read the poll. Fattah is the second choice among white voters, after Nutter. He's not only relying on black support.

Frankly, this post comes pretty close to crossing a line towards racism that has no place on Young Philly Politics.
---
http://benwaxman.com

Ben, how the hell is their

Ben, how the hell is their racism in this post? The man is telling us what he thinks. And, if you think Fattah's support or whatever you call it of Mumia will not effect a certain voting demographic, you are wrong.

There is a difference between sensitivity and absurdity. I see nothing racist in that post. While he may have his numbers wrong, that simply does not amount to your charge.

How and Why

The implication is that Fattah's support only comes from black voters. That's an assertion that doesn't stand up to the facts-- just look at the polling numbers. I think it's pretty problematic, on several levels, to make the assumption that all of Fattah's support comes from "black voters." There is also the implication that African-American voters are monolithic and just reflectively support black candidates. That's just plain inaccurate.

I'm open to the idea that I might be overly sensitive, but I still think my original comment stands.

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http://benwaxman.com

So, essentially what you are

So, essentially what you are saying is that, where someone has a misunderstanding of fact related to polling numbers and Congressman Fattah, they are a racist. I am not getting there. Or, that inaccuracy is racist too. I’m still not there. I find that indicting someone of racism is a way to stifle debate. And, I still do not think he said what you think. I saw an implication on Fattah, not black candidates or voters (and their knowledge of a candidate, not necessarily their full support). Note, all he said was "name recognition."

Ok, ok

I may have jumped the gun. Not trying to stifle debate. I just think that some of the implications are troubling....but whatever. Not the end of the world.

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http://benwaxman.com

An End to Racial Voting?

Wouldn't it be great if, in this Mayoral election, race was not the first thing we used to explain the vote on May 16?

It looks like Fatah and Nutter have plenty of white support. I expect Dwight Evans will as well. And I bet that Brady is going to have substantial black support. Twenty of twenty five African American ward leaders have said they would support him. While ward leader support may not be as important in a Mayoral race--where voters have some knowledge of the candidates as a result of intensive media coverage of the race, televised debates, and television ads--as it does in council races, it is not negligible either. (It is funny to hear some of the same progressives who talk about the tremendous importance of field operations, deny that the ward leaders and committee people will make much of a difference in the Mayoral race.)

Racial voting is primed to be overcome. One reason it has remained so important is that white and black candidates often don't try to appeal to voters of the other race or explain how blacks and whites are all in this together. So racial voting is, in part, a self-fulfilling prophecy.

Another reason is that white candidates often find it difficult to talk about the persistence of racism. White politicians often act as if talking about racism is like talking about someone who has cancer, that is, something that is not talked about in polite company. This is ridiculous. Why would a black voter support a candidate who is not willing to explicitly acknowledge the continued importance of racism in the lives of blacks?

When Mayor Goode was running for reelection, Dave Richardson, who was an State Representataive in NW Philadelphia and a very important black leader in Philadelphia, said that “I’m not voting for Goode because he is black, I’m voting for Goode because I’m black.” If you think about what Richardson said carefully, this is a repudiation of racial voting and an assertion that blacks should vote for candidates who care about their own interests.

(BTW, Richardson was one of few Philadelphia politicians I knew about long before I moved here. I was interested in the issue of reparations for slavery and Richardson was a pioneer on the issue as is his successor, Rep. John Myers who more white progressives should acknowledge as an important progressive leader.)

Racial voting has always been less prominent among blacks than whites. Blacks have been voting for white politicians for years. The opposite is a much more recent occurrence. However the (racist) assumption that blacks will not vote for a white candidate in Philadelphia, sometimes creates a self-fulfilling prophesy as well. Many whites gave me less financial support than I had hoped in 2004 because they did not think I could defeat an African American woman in a district that was about 80% black.

I think, however, that my campaign against Rosita showed that an aggressive effort on the part of a white candidate to win African American votes can be effective. My calculations suggest I received about 35% of the vote of African Americans. (I believe that about 10 to 12 % of whites voted for Rosita.) I did not receive more African American votes mostly because I ran out of time and could not canvass much of the 12th ward. (In Presidential election years, the primary is at the end of April not the middle of May. So not only did I lose three weeks, I lost three weeks at a time when the day is long and its possible to knock on a lot more doors than you can in February.) Whereever I went door to door, I won an even higher percentage of African American votesr. I did very well in many divisions that were overwhelmingly black, came within 6 votes of defeating Rosita in her own division and was one vote shy of her in the next division. Together those divisions were 70% black. Where I had a sympathetic committee person, I won 72% of the vote in another division in Rosita’s ward.

Marc Stier to the rescue

This post is a much clearer articulation of what I tihnk about race and politics in Philadelphia.

You can tell that Marc has been a writer much longer than me. :-)

---
http://benwaxman.com

PS The division in the 13th ward

where I won 72% of the vote was about 97% black.

Just curious ...

How many people voted in that division in that race?

WWGjr

167

I won 120, Rosita 47. 13th ward, 22nd division.

Election Analysis - The Power of Committee Person Support

You won that division of the ward with 72% of the vote - but lost the entire ward with only about 27% of the vote.

So if Rosita won the entire ward with 60% of the vote, why did she really get trounced in that division?

How much of a role did the committee person's support (for you) play in that division?

WWGjr

Obviously a lot

My point, however, was that blacks will vote for whites if whites appeal to blacks. One way politicians appeal to voters is by gaining the support of people they trust, such as good committee people. Everyone who voted for me in that divison knew I was white. In fact, there were as many people in the district who knew me as "the white guy running against Rosita" than there were people who knew my name.

I won the support of black voters in many differen ways, just as I won the support of white voters in many different ways.

In the 4th and 5th divisions of the 13th ward I did well because I had a great white supporter who distributed literature for me and I walked those divisions.

In the 22nd ward, I won because people knew my work as President of West Mt. Airy Neighbors and because, in some divsions, I had effective committee people on my side and because I knocked on every door in the divisions.

In fact, I won a substantial number of African American votes everywhere I walked. But, as I have mentioned before, I ran out of time because the primary was in April not May and because I started late. And I made lots of other mistakes because I was a total political novice.

And that goes back to my overall point: racial voting is not something that is immutable. Race becomes a much less significant factor when white candidates appeal to black voters in effective ways. (And vice versa.) I made an enormous effort to do that in 2004 which was often, but not always, effective. Where I did reach out to African American voters in an effective way I did very well, including among those who had no idea who I was at the start of the campaign.

Ed Rendell over Lynn Swann

Black Democrats in Philadelphia gave a sizable vote to Ed Rendell over Lynn Swann.

As you said, it's not as uncommon as many think.

WWGjr

Somehow, I don't think that

Somehow, I don't think that analogy is entirely applicable. First, Lynn Swann was not a stron candidate (though, I think he could have been stronger). Second, Ed was a decent Philadelphia mayor (and I say decent because I think the man gets too much credit for things that were already going on before his terms and because he left so much untouched in 8 years). Third, Lynn was a republican--not democrat vs. strong democrat.

But, I get the point. It does happen.

How about Lynne Abraham?

Her last two Democratic primary opponents were African-American and she won handily.

That would be a better

That would be a better example.

That's why Rendell was a good example...

It wasn't supposed to be a political analogy related to the 2004 State Representative race in the 198th ... but a bigger and better example of Marc's point.

Why did Blacks in Philly vote for Ed Rendell for Governor?

Because we're mostly Democrats, we knew him and his track record, and we simply thought that he was the better choice.

The majority of Blacks did not vote for Lynne, so Seth won almost every Black ward - but she did receive substantial support in the Black community which gave her the margin of victory.

Blacks voted for either Lynne and Seth because they thought their choice was the best.

Of course, Seth's voters were right! :)

WWGjr

great post, but...

Marc,

This was a great post. I hadn’t really thought about things that way. Also, if what you said were true, you could probably make a great showing in a rematch, if you lost the council seat, which I hope doesn’t happen.

But seriously, I love what Dave Richardson accomplished back in the day, but I think that things are more complicated than that. Yes, Dave was a big part of the Northwest Alliance back in the day. But what did that give us? Donna Miller and John Myers?

You and I may not agree on the 8th District Candidate, but we probably agree that Donna Miler has been a complete failure in Council. John Myers, well, I’m not even sure what to think of him, and that’s saying a lot. All I know is that he is with Donna, and that is enough to tell me about where he is coming from. I have no idea why you think that more progressive leaders should take him seriously though, because everything that I know about him makes me think that he is a sad individual.

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